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Prop 8: Religion on Trial

January 21, 2010 By 4 Comments

The attorneys representing the proponents of California's Proposition 8 have complained bitterly that religion is on trial. The plaintiffs — that is, those who believe that the same sex marriage ban is unconstitutional — have deposed witnesses who show the animus of religious belief toward homosexual people (link is to a related story at GodDiscussion.  For daily live blogging on the trial itself, a list of links is here.)

Another high profile Republican, Cindy McCain, has joined the No H8 campaign.

The trial revealed the Mormon church and Catholic church's marriage in the Prop 8 campaign, under the banner of ProtectMarriage.com.  According to evidence admitted at the trial, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS) sought to create "plausible deniability" with respect to its efforts in the campaign.

A number of witnesses for the Prop 8 defense team withdrew, saying that they feared for their personal safety.  However, the prosecution claimed that the real reason for their withdrawal was because their testimony during pretrial depositions supported marriage equality and they did not want to be cross-examined in the court.  Videos of those witnesses' depositions were shown in court yesterday and were available on YouTube. In view of the fact that these are witnesses that the anti-gay attorneys had chosen to support Proposition 8, their testimony was shocking and lending credibility to the plaintiffs' claim that they withdrew because of cross examination and not fear for their well being. Transcripts of the experts are at the plaintiffs' website: Paul Nathanson, Ph.D, followed by Katherine Young, Ph.D.

Cross-examination at depositions:

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Deborah is the owner and administrator of the site, starting it in February 2009. She received her business education at the University of Texas and operates a number of websites and small businesses. She hosts the God Discussion show and handles the site's technical work and editing.

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  • http://www.toysperiod.com Vincenti Winchester

    As a former member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, I can say categorically that opposing gay marriage by the Church has nothing to do with scripture. (For example, there are gay bishops within the Church, so long as they do not strive to become models for young boys.)

    There is no "plausible deniability" involved with regard to the Church. Their prophets have given countless public interviews on the subject, and refer to gay men as simply "having a problem" that the Church would like to help them correct.

    Within the Church, it is the FEELING simply, as it is in most straight families (the non-Mormon Kennedy family included) that, especially in the case of men, gay MALE behaviors and attitudes are not those that are in keeping with the raising of other wholesome men.

    With women there is much more tolerance. Gay women don't tend to display or teach young men behaviors that are beyond the accepted boundaries of wholesome manhood.

    Bringing this subject into a court of law, and asking a professional psychologist if a gay man feels good about being threatened physically is rather absurd. But, of course, this is the kind of false show of caring our society provides, as we continue to imprison more people per capita than any other nation on Earth in the name of freedom.

    All we are doing with this latest court jestering is perpetuating hate and loathing in the guise of fair judicial process.

    It makes lawyers rich and perhaps famous. But, it does nothing but inflame the man and woman attempting to combat so many elements in American culture that are lacking in wholesomeness.

  • admin

    There is no "plausible deniability" involved with regard to the Church.

    Actually, a statement from the church concerning its "plausible deniability" with respect to the Proposition 8 campaign was introduced into evidence. The term "plausible deniability" came from the church itself.

    Comments such as yours are exactly why this case should have been televised.

  • http://acousticvids.com/mattnathanson Matt N

    Just wanted to say thanks for this

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